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 Post subject: Re: Against bootloaders
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 10:21 am 
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Thread for reference: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=33784


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 Post subject: Re: Against bootloaders
PostPosted: Fri Jul 26, 2019 4:36 am 
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@Schol-R-LEA: I like the change you made to the bootloader paragraph in your new thread. It says everything that's really needed.

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 Post subject: Re: Against bootloaders
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2019 6:20 am 
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thomtl wrote:
Thread for reference: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=33784

I don't understand. There are as many if not more threads about GRUB issues...
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=33766
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=33799
Just to name the most recent two.

Cheers,
bzt


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 Post subject: Re: Against bootloaders
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2019 6:24 am 
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Neither of those threads are about grub, per se.


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 Post subject: Re: Against bootloaders
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2019 6:38 am 
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iansjack wrote:
Neither of those threads are about grub, per se.
True, not the software itself, but they are usability issues of grub, and problems loading OSes using multiboot. Perfect examples that grub and its accompanied multiboot protocol are overcomplicated, therefore not as easy option as one would expect. And that was my original point: it's easier to write a boot record that just loads your kernel like Xv6 does (not to mention that you could use Xv6 boot record as-is to load ANY ELF kernel if you don't want to roll your own loader. It is a hell lot easier to install Xv6 boot record than installing and configuring grub correctly).

Cheers,
bzt


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 Post subject: Re: Against bootloaders
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2019 6:43 am 
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I hardly think that a simple typo in a source file represents a problem with the complexity of either the multiboot standard or GRUB.

As for a failure to read the documentation - that's not a problem unique to GRUB.


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 Post subject: Re: Against bootloaders
PostPosted: Tue Jul 30, 2019 4:02 pm 
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If GRUB is so hard to use, why do people ITT keep acting like writing a bootloader is a litmus test for programming ability?

Pick one guys, either GRUB is too hard or GRUB users are too dumb to write an OS.


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 Post subject: Re: Against bootloaders
PostPosted: Wed Sep 04, 2019 7:10 am 
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I'm in the process of writing my own EFI bootloader, thus far I've been able to successfully transfer control to my kernel. Now I'm working out the rest.
I was led to this decision by how attractive UEFI looks from an osdev perspective, as well as how difficult I found looking for information on how to configure GRUB2 for UEFI. I know the support is there, but I'll be damned if I can find any good resource on it. Figuring out how to set it up was actually more painful by far than reading the UEFI spec, from which I actually learned something.
For me this process has been rewarding. I haven't gotten everything finished yet, far from it, but for others the process can be fun and educational. I can see why you wouldn't advise this as required learning for a developer just starting to learn osdev, but it has definitely given me a better understanding of an important osdev concept. I haven't gotten everything figured out yet, mind you.
For me ( and probably many others ) hardware compatibility is not a factor. Getting your hobby OS working in qemu is enough work.
If the general consensus is so against rolling your own, it might be worthwhile for someone to invest some time in writing a good introduction to using GRUB+UEFI in the wiki.


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