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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 12:39 am 
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I'm similar to most users here: I use a text editor, a makefile, and a few bash scripts to write and build my OS. I test it in QEMU (because it's the easiest to configure - you can just pass the required parameters on the command line) and real machines when I've completed something big and/or likely to fail on a real machine. I've also written a few C utilities to help with preparing some of the more complicated source files and with debugging on real machines (reading and writing filesystem images with my custom filesystem that doesn't yet have a Linux driver, and producing binary dumps from debugging data sent using my audio serial link debugger (as I don't have an RS232 - USB cable), to be specific).

Also I second C# as a development language for Windows (especially GUI) applications. Visual Basic may have (most of) the same features, but the style of the language is somewhat outdated and not as easy to understand as C-syntax languages (such as C# and Java), especially when adapted for object-oriented programming.

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When you start writing an OS you do the minimum possible to get the x86 processor in a usable state, then you try to get as far away from it as possible.

Syntax checkup:
Wrong: OS's, IRQ's, zero'ing
Right: OSes, IRQs, zeroing


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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 3:14 am 
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I'm sorry to say but it's not very likely that a lot of people will use it. The problem is that there are major IDEs that many people spent thousands of hours to implement that are very suitable for OS dev as they are.

I use Eclipse both on Windows and Mac, and it has everything you will every need. You can configure your cross compiler/OS specific toolchain so that it automatically resolves all include paths. It has full code completion, outlines & syntax check. Code versioning integration (there plugins for everything, Mercurial, Git, CVS, whatever, and it's also easy to write your own plugins). Cick-and-run your OS using the "external tools" option.

Setting up Cygwin is not hard. You need to know what you're doing - and that comes with experience. People usually don't manage to go very far when they have everything ready-to-go, you have to truly understand how your toolchain works.

Protip: Concentrate your energy on learning about your toolchain & possibly improve the information on the wiki if you get stuck somewhere.

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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 3:30 am 
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max wrote:
I'm sorry to say but it's not very likely that a lot of people will use it. The problem is that there are major IDEs that many people spent thousands of hours to implement that are very suitable for OS dev as they are.

I use Eclipse both on Windows and Mac, and it has everything you will every need. You can configure your cross compiler/OS specific toolchain so that it automatically resolves all include paths. It has full code completion, outlines & syntax check. Code versioning integration (there plugins for everything, Mercurial, Git, CVS, whatever, and it's also easy to write your own plugins). Cick-and-run your OS using the "external tools" option.

Setting up Cygwin is not hard. You need to know what you're doing - and that comes with experience. People usually don't manage to go very far when they have everything ready-to-go, you have to truly understand how your toolchain works.

Protip: Concentrate your energy on learning about your toolchain & possibly improve the information on the wiki if you get stuck somewhere.

Image


Have you tried the Eclipse debugger with Bochs or QEMU?

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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 4:12 am 
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zenzizenzicube wrote:
Have you tried the Eclipse debugger with Bochs or QEMU?
Ah yes, forgot to mention that, debugging works nicely by using GDB and connecting to QEMU. Didn't try with Bochs though.

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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 5:34 am 
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Quote:
I'm sorry to say but it's not very likely that a lot of people will use it.

I know, I'll definatly use mine :)

And while creating It, I learned how to do syntax highighting, which may be usefull in the future.

The reason I created it is that it will make my life easy when editing and building my OS.

Quote:
The problem is that there are major IDEs that many people spent thousands of hours to implement that are very suitable for OS dev as they are.


Yeah, but they won't have to spend thousands of hours with mine xD

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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 8:03 am 
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Max wrote:
QEMU and GDB
Hmm, didn't have success with that pair recently. Do you use one of those patches available on the Internet?

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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 9:40 am 
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DeezRamChips wrote:
Quote:
The problem is that there are major IDEs that many people spent thousands of hours to implement that are very suitable for OS dev as they are.


Yeah, but they won't have to spend thousands of hours with mine xD
Stop bragging. He was referring to the amount of time that the developers have spent making the IDEs, not the amount of time that users have to spend to set them up and/or use them.

_________________
When you start writing an OS you do the minimum possible to get the x86 processor in a usable state, then you try to get as far away from it as possible.

Syntax checkup:
Wrong: OS's, IRQ's, zero'ing
Right: OSes, IRQs, zeroing


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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 9:42 am 
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max wrote:
I use Eclipse both on Windows and Mac, and it has everything you will every need.
Isn't Eclipse a Java IDE? How easily can you add support for another language, in a non-hackish way?

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When you start writing an OS you do the minimum possible to get the x86 processor in a usable state, then you try to get as far away from it as possible.

Syntax checkup:
Wrong: OS's, IRQ's, zero'ing
Right: OSes, IRQs, zeroing


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 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 9:49 am 
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onlyonemac wrote:
Isn't Eclipse a Java IDE?

No.


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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 9:52 am 
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Eclipse probably supports more "languages" than any other IDE ever created. Although, I haven't used it in years, it was a fairly decent alternative to Visual Studio.

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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 11:45 am 
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onlyonemac wrote:
max wrote:
I use Eclipse both on Windows and Mac, and it has everything you will every need.
Isn't Eclipse a Java IDE? How easily can you add support for another language, in a non-hackish way?


If Emacs is a kitchen sink short of a house, Eclipse is a small country. There's a plugin for anything and everything on the Eclipse Marketplace.
I've never written a plugin to support another language but it seems quite overcomplicated and overengineered, however someone else has probably already done it.

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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2016 1:04 pm 
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DeezRamChips wrote:
I know, I'll definatly use mine :)

And while creating It, I learned how to do syntax highighting, which may be usefull in the future.

The reason I created it is that it will make my life easy when editing and building my OS.
Sure, I don't mean to discourage you - I also write a lot of tools that help me with debugging. For example I made a Java program that connects to the VM over the serial port and allows me to visually display task structures on the host etc. for debugging. There isn't really anything that does this. It makes sense to build that stuff, but for basic things like an IDE I rather stick to more advanced & complete solutions like Eclipse.

Roman wrote:
Hmm, didn't have success with that pair recently. Do you use one of those patches available on the Internet?
No, why patch it? IIRC I just built it for my target (--target=i686-ghost) and it works well. Maybe open a thread with your errors and I'll see if I can help.

zenzizenzicube wrote:
If Emacs is a kitchen sink short of a house, Eclipse is a small country. There's a plugin for anything and everything on the Eclipse Marketplace.
I've never written a plugin to support another language but it seems quite overcomplicated and overengineered, however someone else has probably already done it.
True, Eclipse has support for literally anything software-related I've ever dealt with (even lots of proprietary stuff). I wrote a plugin to support syntax highlighting for my Capri script language (my interpreter-fun-project) and yes - the API is a little weird - but it's not utterly terrible.

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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2016 4:23 pm 
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DeezRamChips wrote:
Anyway, here is a Screenshot of it:
Image

Hadn't seen this before, it looks pretty good!

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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2016 4:33 pm 
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I disagree with any of "C++ is not for GUI and it needs 100000 lines of code to create simple window.".
95 percent of GUI apps you use (and OSes) are coded in C++.
Took me 300 lines of C++ and 150 lines of .RC to write a paint program for BMP which could render rectangles, lines, can inspect pixel, etc.

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 Post subject: Re: OS Studio, An OS deving optimized IDE
PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2016 5:56 am 
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Quote:
Hadn't seen this before, it looks pretty good!


Thanks :D

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